Ultimate Shinobi - A Naruto RPG
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Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done)

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NuclearTreerat
NuclearTreerat

Age : 48
Posts : 1036

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptySun 14 Aug 2011, 12:50 am

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Editedit_zpscde1b27d
Hinamori, Toshiro.
Main: Fighting: Sad: Pissed Off!: Ending

THE INFO.

Name: Hinamori, Toshiro
Nickname:
Toshi - A shorted form of his name used by those whom he is extremely close to, namely Kimiko and her sister along with his immediate family.
Snowy or Shiro-chan - A nickname originally used by his sisters to tease him that he despises as it was his sister Asusha's favorite "pet name" for him.
Devil Shark of the Hidden Leaf (Akumakou no Konoha) - His moniker in the Bingo Book of other villages. The names origins reach back to his time as a chuunin but it became fixed after an one-on-one encounter left one of Kirigakure's better swordsmen so impressed that he referred to Toshiro in his mission report as “a Leaf-nin who fights like a shark with the soul of a devil.”
Bastard-sensei - the “term of loving endearment” that those who have had the (mis)fortune to be his students apply to him when he isn’t around to inflict further pain on them.
Age: 26
Gender: Male
Appearance: Having finished growing at roughly 18, Toshiro now stands a shade over 5 feet 11 inches (180 cm) tall with a strong build leaving his weight around 180 lbs. plus equipment (which often adds another 90 lbs).  The years have turned his eyes from a bright teal to a darker forest green with hints of brown and he wears his white hair to just below his shoulders - collecting most of it into a low ponytail while the rest is left lose since it refuses to stay in place. Like most of his kin he is only slightly tanned despite years spent mostly outdoors and sports the marks of his chosen profession in the form of many scars of which the largest are on the front & back of his right shoulder and right thigh. In addition he had the words "Hikariha Kurayamino Nakade" ("Light in the Dark" - the motto of his clan's equivalent to ANBU) added around the sides and bottom of  the water dragon imprinted into the skin on his right shoulder.

After recent events Toshiro was finally convinced (i.e. badgered) by the females in his life into exchanging his “one set for all situations” wardrobe for something a bit more diverse. His typical mission attire is mostly unchanged, consisting of either Konoha's standard jounin uniform or charcoal grey pants with extra pockets and a dark blue or black long-sleeved shirt. In either case he wears black open-toed sandals or black boot into which is tucked the cuffs of his pants with the lower portion taped close to the shin and a net undershirt with sleeves that reach mid-forearm under a grey long-sleeved shirt with cloth strips wound from the middle of his forearm to wrists along with his black fingerless sap gloves. Over these will be his chuunin vest with two additional pockets added to the lower front. In either case he secures his bow, its combination holster & quiver, and the scabbards holding his two swords (both hilts over the right shoulder) to a shoulder belt that connects to a second belt and to this belt are attached 3 pouches holding those items & supplies not sealed into scrolls or stored in his vest in lieu of a backpack. Strapped to the top of the larger middle pack is a rolled up "gum blanket", blanket, rain poncho, and tarp.

When not on duty he typically wears slacks or jeans along with sneakers and either a black polo shirt or a white button-up shirt with a yellow kerchief and a dark grey sport coat for more "up-scale" occasions. Regardless of what clothes he's wearing, he keeps a sapphire pendant on a steel chain on his person along with the single gold pin that carries his clan's crest on his collar.

Forehead Protector: Tied around his head with the plate centered and two additional plates at the sides with the loose ends of the black cloth brushing  the back of his neck. The metal portions has been treated with a temper that turned them a non-reflective blue tint except where the Hidden Leaf symbol is etched.

Personality: Compared to when he graduated from Konoha's academy Toshiro has done a bit of growing up when it comes to dealing with other people. No longer automatically cold and distrustful of those outside his kin and immediate friends he has gained a slowly growing circle of friends which includes civilians as well as other shinobi.  Even in situations that involve groups of people he doesn't know he can manage to remain sociable if not exactly lively and might eventually open up after several hours. At such times he can show a dry and sarcastic wit that is as often aimed at himself as others. He is also much more willing to demonstrate concern for others without trying to hide it as the past years have taught him that sometimes the best thing you can do for someone is to let them know you care. In light of that it isn’t surprising that he remains close to his family (especially his younger sister Aki), regularly spending a great deal of his free time with them. Otherwise when not on an assignment he is usually in the company of his girlfriend  or friends, or at one of the smithies around his residence where he trades his growing talent for metalwork both practical and artistic for access to facilities when he doesn’t want to use his clan’s smithy.

On first meeting him, if they aren’t informed of his moniker beforehand, non-shinobi rarely associate him with the ninja known as the “Devil Shark”. Not overly blood-thirsty or aggressive normally, he's not that different from other shinobi of similar rank in being a bit jaded with a lax attitude for most rules and regulations to the point appearing lazy at times. Despite this “friendly and nice” facet, it should be remembered that his title was given him by a shinobi, and an exceptionally dangerous one, from a village known for ninja whose bloodlust is second only to their ruthlessness and skill. If provoked Toshiro is capable of a level of (indiscriminate) violence and ruthlessness normally associated with the more violent nuke-nin. Among the quickest ways to trigger such an outburst is favorable mention of his rogue sister, threats of any sort to his girlfriend, and threats to her or his family (as he considers the former to be part of the later). Mentioning the first can get you a cold glare, ignored, or buried head first into a wall depending on how his day is going. The later will see you lucky to be able to crawl away with most of your limbs somewhat attached.  The second - well the last time he heard of that a noble had an accident involving a fall and the family honor sword that left his intestines strung out over some three flights of stairs. Obviously he's also extremely protective - to the point of a hair-trigger temper - of those he values. He finds members of bloodline-bearing clans to generally be annoying “one-trick ponies” with more ego than ability if they're bloodline is neutralized, and loathes titled nobility and those with extreme amounts of inherited wealth for the way they treat the “lower classes” as inferior simply due to not having been born into a family with a pedigree (inbreeding chart as Toshiro calls it) or wealth. However he does recognize that there are the rare exceptions (his own clan being one of them), and these he respects highly for their ability to simply be human in the face of so much stupidity. He also respects those who have risen in stature despite having had no inherited advantages or even inherited disadvantages. Meeting such people only increases his drive to change how the village deals with its ninja when it comes to pay and training in the hope that eventually every ninja starts out with an equal chance of living long enough to maybe retire.

Those who have had the (mis)fortune to be his students know a different side of him, that being a mix of nurturing behavior and sadistic tort... err training. On one hand he doesn't hestitate to bend, break, or outright murder the rules (written & otherwise) to give his students every advantage possible. Nor does he hesitate to lend a hand with their more personal problems, even though he firmly believes that experience is the best teach.  On the other hand his pupils quickly learn to deal with pain & embarrassment due to the less-than-orthodox training methods he frequently employs. And above all they learn quickly to not truly annoy him unless they like running around Konoha until they puke.

In light of that it isn’t unexpected that over seven years spent in service to the village has removed what little tolerance he had for those who can't handle the ugly side of being a ninja. Already having lost several close people to the ninja's constant companion, he has also had to the face nearly losing the one person he values above all others and come to terms with another sisters betrayal. As far he is concerned if someone is not ready to put everything into being a shinobi, and that includes being able to function through a whole lot of emotional pain, then they should never be one as such "play-ninja" only get others killed in the end. Those same years, and the uncomfortable secrets he had learned during them, have also eroded his loyalty to the village.  Not enough to make him consider leaving (at least not seriously) but if it matters should come to the point of choosing between those he holds dear or the village, the later is very likely to lose out.

Clan: Hinamori
Nindō: "If something is worth fighting for it is worth dying for, and if it is worth dying for it is worth killing for. I am willing to fight, die, and kill for those I hold dear."
"High or low, birth only sets where you start on your climb in life. How far you set your sights is up to you."

THE NINJA.

Origin: Land of Fire
Affiliation: Konohagakure
Rank: S-rank/ Sennin
Specialties: Ninjutsu (Main) Weapons (Sub): Close (Primary) & Long (Secondary)
Elemental Affinities: Water, Wind
Combat Style: By nature an aggressive fighter who prefers to meet enemies at close range to bring as many of his own abilities to bear while restricting his opponents options. However Toshiro is nothing if not adaptable and readily changes his tactics to attack what he believes the oppositions weaknesses to be. Enemies should be advised that he is trained to win at all costs - not only is throwing dirt or spitting into an enemies eyes something he does, but a normal tactic. The only tactics he abhors and refuses to use except under extreme circumstances are those that use bystanders as shields or pawns. With his combination of speed and substantial chakra reserves, should his initial ambush fail or not be possible he frequently tries to draw out the fight until his opponent makes a mistake then quickly move to capitalize on that mistake. When in a group he frequently functions as either a close-range attacker or mid-to-long range support, and in either role often acts as a bodyguard for those who are not as adept in close-combat by intercepting attackers before they can cause trouble.

Combat Special Characteristics:
Spoiler:

Social Special Characteristics
Spoiler:

THE BACKGROUND.

History:
Birth Arc
Spoiler:

Academy Arc
Spoiler:

Genin
Spoiler:

Chuunin Arc
Spoiler:

Roleplay Sample:;
Spoiler:

Face Claim: Gin Kata (retouched)
Link: here
Anime: None, RPG character (link above)


Last edited by NuclearTreerat on Sat 28 Feb 2015, 2:48 am; edited 36 times in total
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NuclearTreerat
NuclearTreerat

Age : 48
Posts : 1036

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyTue 16 Aug 2011, 6:03 am

THE ARSENAL.

Academy Jutsu
Spoiler:

Ninjutsu-Bloodline
Spoiler:

Non-Elemental
Spoiler:

Suiton Jutsu
Spoiler:

Fuuton Jutsu
Spoiler:

Genjutsu
Spoiler:

Weaponry
Spoiler:

Taijutsu
Spoiler:

Scrolls
Spoiler:

Weapons & Equipment
Spoiler:


Last edited by NuclearTreerat on Tue 31 Mar 2015, 6:06 pm; edited 25 times in total
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NuclearTreerat
NuclearTreerat

Age : 48
Posts : 1036

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyThu 16 Aug 2012, 5:18 am

Summons
Name: Tonbi
Rank: B (50 CP)
Appearance:
Spoiler:
Still four feet tall, Tonbi's feathers have returned to a coloration similar to what he had as a chick. Namely a red-trimmed white on the underside and a burnished gold on the rest save for a patch on each wing that is white rimmed with black and the white and black areas of his head. As the equivalent of a senior officer in his clan (which is organized somewhat like a Greek city-state in that every able-bodied pheasant is expected to be ready for military duty), he has once again altered what he wears. Replacing the short haori and flak vest he once wore is a black zip-up tactical vest with concealed armor on the inside and enough pockets and holsters to carry small weapons. On the back of this and secured by a tight-fighting sleeve is the cyclindrical case that holds the scroll used to reverse-summon his summoner, a small pack holding miscallenous field supplies, and two smaller sleeves that hold a pair of ninjato with specially designed hilts that just reach to each side of his neck.

Personality:
Spoiler:

Contract Type: Clan
Species: Pheasant
Specialty: Weapons
Elemental Affinity: Wind
Summons Jutsu:
Spoiler:

Name: Kanako (Fragrant Konoha Child") but often shorted to "Kanko"
Rank: B
Appearance:
Spoiler:
At 3 feet 4 inches tall, Kanako is a rather attractive (if you're a pheasant) hen whose feathers are pure white with the exception of her crest and underside which are jet black and a red mask. Unlike her peers she rarely dons "human" garb, with the exception of her hitai-ate which is worn on as a choker around her neck on a grey cloth and a pair of white cloth bandoleers. To these are attached the white scroll case that holds her scroll to reverse-summon Toshiro, five tanto's that she uses for her Kaiten Shuriken no Jutsu, and a small pack containing several boxes of crackers and a few tubs of very spicy cheese spread.

Personality:
Spoiler:

Contract Type: Clan
Species: Pheasant
Specialty: Ninjutsu (50 CP)
Elemental Affinity: Wind
Summons Jutsu:
Spoiler:


Last edited by NuclearTreerat on Tue 17 Feb 2015, 7:37 am; edited 1 time in total
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Enzo
Kumo Nin
Enzo

Age : 29
Posts : 1797

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyFri 24 Aug 2012, 7:29 pm

Apologies for the wait. There's nothing wrong with the app, as all that was really changed was the location of the jutsu and some minor tweaks to the appearance, personality, etc. Either way:

Re-approved
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http://www.ultimateshinobi.darkbb.com/forum
Kite
Kumo Nin
Kite

Age : 34
Posts : 1209

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptySun 03 Feb 2013, 2:15 am

On February 2nd this character application was edited to help expand the arsenal section as it was too large to add more to it. The edits that were made were the deletion of three staff posts detailing the approval of this character application and the changing of Nuclear's post commenting about his character needing to be re-approved after being un-archived. Thank you.
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Anna
Anna

Age : 31
Posts : 1900

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptySun 09 Nov 2014, 5:25 am

Archived due to failure to respond to activity check. Please message staff to have your character unarchived.
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lifeanddeath
lifeanddeath

Age : 31
Posts : 1490

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyMon 16 Feb 2015, 10:48 pm

Unarchived due to user request.
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NuclearTreerat
NuclearTreerat

Age : 48
Posts : 1036

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyThu 05 Mar 2015, 3:47 pm

*punt*

Really people. 14 days, post in application assistance, and STILL newer applications getting multiple replies & finished before this one gets a single look?
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Mugen Kousen
Mugen Kousen

Age : 33
Posts : 718

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyThu 05 Mar 2015, 10:56 pm

Apologies for your delay. I would have gotten to your app sooner had I known it was pending re-approval. Please note that I am still a trial mod. If you have any issues with the grading I'm giving, I'd be glad to discuss/debate them, but ultimately you can always just go over my head at any point and consult a fully-fledged mod or admin.

Face Claim:
-The link provided takes me to a picture of a dragon on a drawbridge...Please update this.

Hand Seals:
-Many of your jutsu make no mention of hand seals required. Please go through your app and add how many hand seals are required to perform said jutsu. I realize this kind of detail has not been enforced widespread throughout the site, but I'm trying to change that. Otherwise things like hand speed movement SCs and such would be pointless in the face of jutsu that have an undetermined number of hand seals.

Multi Jutsu Casting:
-You have a few jutsu that mention other jutsu being used in conjunction with them. Currently, you are not allowed to use two jutsu at the same time. So long as you are still supplying chakra to one jutsu, you can't cast another. So make sure you end the use of the initial jutsu before executing the follow ups.

Suiton: Hari no Supure (Water Release: Needle Spray):
-The numbers seem a bit intense for a D-rank jutsu. Please lower them from 10/20 to 5/10. This shouldn't affect the primary functionality of the jutsu as a distraction.

Suiton: Fukai no no Me (Water Release: Eyes of the Deep):
-This should require some dedicated concentration on the user's part. For example, Gaara's sand eye jutsu requires one of his eyes be closed. Please add some kind of similar requirement for this jutsu.

Suiton: Teppōdama (Water Release: Gunshot):
-Please note the size/dimensions of the water bullet.

Suigadan - Water Fang Projectile:
-How big is this projectile?

Daikoudan no Jutsu - Great Shark Missile Technique:
-How big is this shark?

Nami Sagan (Wave Break):
-Please alter the wording to make it clear how you are producing the wave. I assume you are using the weapon to do so, but it could be construed that you use a separate water jutsu and it just isn't 100% clear with current wording.

Suimeishi (Water Manifestation):
-I'm pretty sure that chakra conductive metal doesn't take on the properties of elements. If you're just making a water construct based on the weapon extend, bend, etc, then this is fine. But it sounds like you're making metal or even wood move like a fluid under your control. That would require a unique weapon with unique traits/abilities.

Soraiku Wokaesu (Return Strike):
-I'm denying this jutsu on the basis of two points.

-The first is that it states that you defend against an attack with the "end" of your weapon before applying force and leverage. But this is the opposite of how leverage works. The end of your weapon is where you would have the least amount of leverage over your opponent's weapon and where they would have the most amount of leverage on your own weapon. If you'd like to test this out, you can hold a broom or a stick and try to keep it steady as a helper strikes the "weapon" both at the end and at the base(closer to where your grip currently is.)

-The second is that you state the victim is unable to block your follow up attack with the same weapon that was blocked. If you have enough time to go from redirecting their blow into an attack, then your opponent has the time to alter the angle of their weapon in a manner that would effectively block your attack. Especially since this jutsu specifically states that your counter strike follows the length of your target's weapon. There are a number of other ways your opponent could reasonably block such a technique, but they are situational and depend on the type of weapon they have.

-I understand clearly what you are trying to do, it's a common enough maneuver, especially in anime sword fights. What made me inclined to deny it is how absolute the wording made it seem. Lose the "can't be blocked with the same weapon used to attack" aspect and I'd be willing to approve it. But I'd suggest altering the part about catching an incoming attack with then "end" of your weapon. If your opponent has equal strength SCs, this could put you at a disadvantage depending on what weapons were involved in the clash.

Sakkaku Dansu (Illusion Dance):
-There is no weaponry aspect to this jutsu making it purely tai. Since you lack that spec and this jutsu is higher than C-rank, you must alter/remove it.

-If you give it a weaponry aspect in some way, you can register it as Wep+Tai and get the same effect.

Shuriken Kage Bunshin no Jutsu - Shuriken Shadow Clone Technique:
-How many clones are created?

Namigekishi (Violent Wave) (40):
-Why does this have a 40 in parenthesis? o.O

-Could you please add fuuton to this jutsu? I just can't see it having the desired effect with pure chakra alone. By the time the chakra dispersed outwards more than a few meters it would likely lose effectiveness without an elemental nature to strengthen it. This isn't a required edit, but it would make me feel much better about approving it.

Combat Sebon:
-Just a reoccurring typo here. They are called "Senbon" not "Sebon"
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NuclearTreerat
NuclearTreerat

Age : 48
Posts : 1036

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyMon 09 Mar 2015, 4:05 am

I'll fix the faceclaim link when I get the time to reactive the account where I store my images. Shouldn't be more than a few days assuming no stupidity on their end.

Made changes to water bullet & eyes of the deep that should fit.
As to some of the other points

Wave break: Here could be a problem. As you might see by the requirement, this jutsu predates the current SC's. To provide some background, at the time the ninjutsu specialty was split into 1 per element and the suiton version allowed the character to create large amounts of water without expending chakra at all. So at the time where the wave came from wasn't an issue. Now however...

Two fixes I have in mind rightn ow.
A) Removal, with refund of the AF spent if I find that it wasn't created under the old jutsu training rules. Finding that out will probably take time I don't have right now due to work but if it didn't cost any AF I'm not going to miss it - never used it.
B) I could rework it require a currently active suiton jutsu used instead of specifying a wave with the intensity of the result increasing with the rank of the jutsu so sacrificed.

Suigadan - Water Fang Projectile, Daikoudan no Jutsu - Great Shark Missile Technique, Shuriken Kage Bunshin no Jutsu - Shuriken Shadow Clone Technique:
Each of these is directly from the sites encyclopedia so if you want an answer to those questions you'll have to get the rest of the staff to come up with and post a revised version there.
Before you ask someone to make changes, check to make sure the technique isn't from the encyclopedia. It avoids extra work and keeps you casting doubt on your own credentials.

Suimeshi:
Who says it can't? Maybe not on its own no but jutsu alone can create a sword out of water with the ability to slice through fire without being boiled away. So is it really that far of a stretch that a more advanced jutsu channeled through a weapon designed to be sensitive to chakra could alter said weapons physical properties to take on a particular nature?

Illusion Dance:
The weaponry aspect is in the requirement; one needs Taijutsu or Weaponry to have access to the Tier III speed SC which the jutsu requires. Plus, in terms of effect, its akin to one of the most common defenses found in armed combat - avoiding an incoming attack by moving quickly out of the way. Aka dodging the blow. In this case a dodge that happens faster than the SC at the expense of CP (a finite resource) to leave behind a short-lived "decoy" effect to help cover the sudden movement. So to be blunt I really don't see your objection here. Particularly in light of the staff having pre-created techniques from ninjutsu & sealing (which has zero relation to physical movement) that accelerate movement (see Body Replace, Body Flicker, Flying Thunder God) to just as (if not higher) levels of speed.

Return Strike
Hmmm, seems we're not quite looking at this technique in the same way.  To reference you example, you seem to be implying that weapon of the jutsu's user is stationary (once in position) until its hit THEN trying to redirect the attack. Something of a brute-force and reactive approach in that it relies first on directly countering the bulk of force in the attack then forcing it aside. To put it in familiar terms that is akin to how a boxer would block an attack - take the brunt on the implement (arm) and only give enough to bleed off what force can't be absorbed.

What this jutsu does is more akin to a "soft" style like Judo or Akido in that it you're not trying to stop or reduce the force of the blow but rather redirect it to follow a different path. Sticking with the unarmed analogy, its akin to a circular block where the back of the hand contacts the incoming wrist then continues the motion & contact through such along with a small element of the "grab the attack pull into it" (in this case by getting the end of  ones weapon behind the attackers) to upset the attackers balance and control. Going back to you example, its not simply letting the broom get hit but rather swinging your handle so that the last few inches - where the greatest amount of force is concentrated during a swing - meets the oncoming weapon during the latter's own swing. Then using that force, which gets progressively stronger as the opponents weapon slides down your own towards the grip, plus the attacks own momentum to move the attack to a different path by before launching your counter attack.

That said I'm not adverse to making a FEW changes. If the overall effectiveness stays the same and said change aren't the sort that negate the whole purpose of the jutsu. Remember you are requiring the removal what is the primary purpose behind the technique - a counter-attack that can not be avoided without expending some sort of resource. Be it CP for a jutsu, pulling a second weapon out, or having to backpedal out of reach there MUST be a cost for avoiding the follow-up strike that isn't "I dodge/ block using the same weapon that I should have to first bring around to get back between the attack and myself".  So spit out a few ideas and I'll see if any of them fit what I have in mind.

Violent Wave: The (40) is a relic of staff being too lazy tidy up themselves and too in a rush to give me time to clean it up myself between approval and transfer. As you can see I cleaned it up myself now that the application is unlocked. For adding the elemental part - nope. Sorry but there is no reason why "pure" chakra should break up any faster than say wind. Otherwise shadowclones & the rasegan would be less durable than even basic water clones as they're specifically made of pure chakra. Not to mention that in this case the use of "pure chakra" is a tradeoff. Specifically as a non-elemental technique it has neither the advantage of trumping an element or the weakness of falling to another. So while it can't really be stopped by (say) an A-ranked fire attack (which really shouldn't stop it - just creating a nasty wall of fire that moves outwards) it also isn't unstoppable by even S-rank lightning jutsu.

For the multicasting (as in having one jutsu active then initiating another), I'm going to have to ask for a quote from or link to the section of rules or the post by a FULL & current staff member where that is officially stated to be the case. Particularly when the aforementioned rule runs contrary to all prior experience not to mention logic and is no where listed in the sites rules that I've been able to find. Even more so in light of just how badly this would render jutsu like Lightning Armor moot as one would have to drop said (very expensive) jutsu to use even a simple D-rank one.

In the same vein, while I wish you luck as a "hand seal count" is something that should have been added from day one (and I use the concept in my own Naruto campaign) I am going to say NO to adding a fixed number of hand seals to these unless you can again prove that this is an actual rule by the staff and not something you want to see implemented. Why is for several reasons. One because with regards to the majority of weaponry techniques it simply makes zero sense as the characters hand shouldn't leave the weapon in a fight.  Two, there is no such mention for any of the jutsu in the encyclopedia, which I would think would be updated BEFORE such a rule went into force, if only to the supposedly over-worked staff from having to redo the same material twice. Mostly though because I've been through every single section of the rules since I joined this site and never ONCE has there been mention of a requirement for jutsu to list the number of handseals. Nor in all the time here have I had or even heard of a staff member requiring a jutsu to list the number of handseals, or even mentioned adding such to the encyclopedia jutsu.
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Mugen Kousen
Mugen Kousen

Age : 33
Posts : 718

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyMon 09 Mar 2015, 6:47 am

Quote :
Wave break: Here could be a problem. As you might see by the requirement, this jutsu predates the current SC's. To provide some background, at the time the ninjutsu specialty was split into 1 per element and the suiton version allowed the character to create large amounts of water without expending chakra at all. So at the time where the wave came from wasn't an issue. Now however...

Two fixes I have in mind rightn ow.
A) Removal, with refund of the AF spent if I find that it wasn't created under the old jutsu training rules. Finding that out will probably take time I don't have right now due to work but if it didn't cost any AF I'm not going to miss it - never used it.
B) I could rework it require a currently active suiton jutsu used instead of specifying a wave with the intensity of the result increasing with the rank of the jutsu so sacrificed.

I think you misunderstand what I was asking of you. All you need to do is add in that you make a slashing movement against a pre-existing source of water to create the wave. Or perhaps draw a line through it with one of your feet. As a suiton based weaponry jutsu, this would be more than enough to generate the kind of wave you're going for. You could even probably just generate the water from your chakra. All I'm asking for is the actions involved in making the wave in the first place. Your previous wording kind of just assumed the wave was made without explaining how. It's an elemental weaponry jutsu so it can push the boundaries of what one might consider possible with a weapon in real life.

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Suigadan - Water Fang Projectile, Daikoudan no Jutsu - Great Shark Missile Technique, Shuriken Kage Bunshin no Jutsu - Shuriken Shadow Clone Technique:
Each of these is directly from the sites encyclopedia so if you want an answer to those questions you'll have to get the rest of the staff to come up with and post a revised version there.
Before you ask someone to make changes, check to make sure the technique isn't from the encyclopedia. It avoids extra work and keeps you casting doubt on your own credentials.

I understand your concern, however I have already made a thread in the staff section about updating the encyclopedia stuff and had the request approved several days ago. It's merely a matter of getting around to it and will likely be a slow process perhaps taking even as long as a month. Especially since we plan on posting all updates up in the staff section for group approval before we make them official.

That being said, I know from experience that you're allowed to alter the dimensions of encyclopedia stuff to suit your own individual needs when registering a jutsu. It would just be a slightly customized version of the encyclopedia version. So I'm still going to ask you to add those dimensions. If you have a problem with it or would prefer not to do so, I encourage you to consult Mods/Admins. But honestly this is nothing but an advantage for you as you get to set your own standards for the jutsu you'll personally be using. I can't imagine how that would be a downside. Heck, what you put may even be used in the encyclopedia itself if staff collectively agree that it sounds reasonable as the site-wide standard.

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Suimeshi:
Who says it can't? Maybe not on its own no but jutsu alone can create a sword out of water with the ability to slice through fire without being boiled away. So is it really that far of a stretch that a more advanced jutsu channeled through a weapon designed to be sensitive to chakra could alter said weapons physical properties to take on a particular nature?

Yes, it's a far stretch to insist that a solid which happens to be chakra conductive is just as malleable as pure elemental chakra. If this were a unique weapon made from a unique material specifically designed for this function it would be one thing. But there is no evidence that I'm aware of to suggest normal chakra conductive metal/wood/etc is capable of this kind of manipulation. If you know of any evidence to support that then please bring it forward and I'll re-evaluate my understanding of what chakra conductive weapons are capable of.

If you can't find such evidence, I suggest you just make the jutsu an extension from the blade made of pressurized water. You would get the same basic functionality.

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Illusion Dance:
The weaponry aspect is in the requirement; one needs Taijutsu or Weaponry to have access to the Tier III speed SC which the jutsu requires. Plus, in terms of effect, its akin to one of the most common defenses found in armed combat - avoiding an incoming attack by moving quickly out of the way. Aka dodging the blow. In this case a dodge that happens faster than the SC at the expense of CP (a finite resource) to leave behind a short-lived "decoy" effect to help cover the sudden movement. So to be blunt I really don't see your objection here. Particularly in light of the staff having pre-created techniques from ninjutsu & sealing (which has zero relation to physical movement) that accelerate movement (see Body Replace, Body Flicker, Flying Thunder God) to just as (if not higher) levels of speed.

This jutsu along with many others on your app was actually pm'd to me by Trey a few days ago asking my opinion on them. I responded with a reply almost verbatim what I posted here. I'll need to wait on his reply before I can respond. But in short, you've convinced me that it's fine. We'll see if Mr. head honcho feels the same way.

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Return Strike
Hmmm, seems we're not quite looking at this technique in the same way.  To reference you example, you seem to be implying that weapon of the jutsu's user is stationary (once in position) until its hit THEN trying to redirect the attack. Something of a brute-force and reactive approach in that it relies first on directly countering the bulk of force in the attack then forcing it aside. To put it in familiar terms that is akin to how a boxer would block an attack - take the brunt on the implement (arm) and only give enough to bleed off what force can't be absorbed.

What this jutsu does is more akin to a "soft" style like Judo or Akido in that it you're not trying to stop or reduce the force of the blow but rather redirect it to follow a different path. Sticking with the unarmed analogy, its akin to a circular block where the back of the hand contacts the incoming wrist then continues the motion & contact through such along with a small element of the "grab the attack pull into it" (in this case by getting the end of  ones weapon behind the attackers) to upset the attackers balance and control. Going back to you example, its not simply letting the broom get hit but rather swinging your handle so that the last few inches - where the greatest amount of force is concentrated during a swing - meets the oncoming weapon during the latter's own swing. Then using that force, which gets progressively stronger as the opponents weapon slides down your own towards the grip, plus the attacks own momentum to move the attack to a different path by before launching your counter attack.

That said I'm not adverse to making a FEW changes. If the overall effectiveness stays the same and said change aren't the sort that negate the whole purpose of the jutsu. Remember you are requiring the removal what is the primary purpose behind the technique - a counter-attack that can not be avoided without expending some sort of resource. Be it CP for a jutsu, pulling a second weapon out, or having to backpedal out of reach there MUST be a cost for avoiding the follow-up strike that isn't "I dodge/ block using the same weapon that I should have to first bring around to get back between the attack and myself".  So spit out a few ideas and I'll see if any of them fit what I have in mind.

I understood your weapon wasn't stationary with this jutsu, but the way you worded seemed to imply that you were using leverage on the enemies weapon. I gave the stationary example to show how leverage on two objects works. If you were referring the the leverage on your own weapon then I simply misunderstood your wording. But even considering that the majority of the force behind your attack is at the end of your weapon due to the way you leverage your swing, if you strike the opponent's weapon near the base(close to their grip), they would have the leverage advantage.

As someone who has participated in an extensive amount of sparring matches with training weapons and live edged weapons(not the brightest of ideas admittedly) I can say with firm confidence that the principles of aikido and judo's hand to hand techniques can't really be applied in the same way with weapons. I'm aware that Akido has sword techniques as well and also have experience with them. But in practice, they almost never work outside of the dojo as it's totally reliant on an opponent that is dead set in a kata whom is completely committing all of their force into a rigid attack. No one fights like this outside of a dojo in a full force sparring match though. So it's meaningless to use it as an example for actual combat. Every single aikido sword technique I've ever been shown is always easily defeated by simply having good footwork or altering the positioning of your own weapon. Does this mean I can defeat them every time without flaw? No, of course not. But they are rarely effective because of how dependant they are that your opponent is moving in a specific manner.

Granted, this is not a reality based forum, it's a naruto based one and even if it weren't it is most certainly possible to redirect the force of an opponent's attack in the method you're describing. It's a simple enough parry. However, this still wouldn't guarantee that your opponent would be unable to do anything with their parried weapon before your counter attack lands. Changing the orientation of their weapon and taking a step in one direction or another could completely change the outcome.

The problem here is that you want a jutsu that has an absolute and determined response from your opponent without taking the context of a situation into mind. I'm not going to approve something like that because it's pseudo-godmoding(forces your opponent to be acting in a certain manner with their body). But at the same time, I encourage you to see that unless your opponent has the speed to keep up with you, they would obviously be incapable of making the movements required to stop your counter attack in time. So while no, I won't approve a jutsu that will without a doubt render a parried weapon incapable of being used to defend against your counter, that doesn't mean you'll never be able to hit someone with the counter. Nor does it mean that your opponent won't need to expend some kind of cost to deal with it. If you want to be sure your opponent can never counter-defend in time, then just don't use this jutsu on other people with Speed SCs to ensure they won't be able to keep up with your movements.

I will stubbornly remain adamant about this because of the semi-godmod aspect, so if you still disagree you'll need to go over my head.

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Violent Wave: The (40) is a relic of staff being too lazy tidy up themselves and too in a rush to give me time to clean it up myself between approval and transfer. As you can see I cleaned it up myself now that the application is unlocked. For adding the elemental part - nope. Sorry but there is no reason why "pure" chakra should break up any faster than say wind. Otherwise shadowclones & the rasegan would be less durable than even basic water clones as they're specifically made of pure chakra. Not to mention that in this case the use of "pure chakra" is a tradeoff. Specifically as a non-elemental technique it has neither the advantage of trumping an element or the weakness of falling to another. So while it can't really be stopped by (say) an A-ranked fire attack (which really shouldn't stop it - just creating a nasty wall of fire that moves outwards) it also isn't unstoppable by even S-rank lightning jutsu.

You use the rasengan as an example, but it's an entirely different use of pure chakra. The rasengan is a highly condensed ball of violently spinning chakra which is constantly being fed by the user. The jutsu you would like to create is still a highly condensed mass of chakra, but it's not in a tightly compact ball getting a constant supply from the user. It's a widely spread out wave that has to get larger and less condensed as it moves outwards and it does not receive a continued supply.

In the case of Shadow Clones, they are given a hefty portion of the user's chakra to maintain themselves with. As much as half. When they run out of said chakra, they disappear.

This is another one of those jutsu Trey asked my opinion on so until I hear back from what he thinks about my grading, I'm gonna stick to my guns unless you can convince me otherwise as you did with Illusion Dance.

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For the multicasting (as in having one jutsu active then initiating another), I'm going to have to ask for a quote from or link to the section of rules or the post by a FULL & current staff member where that is officially stated to be the case. Particularly when the aforementioned rule runs contrary to all prior experience not to mention logic and is no where listed in the sites rules that I've been able to find. Even more so in light of just how badly this would render jutsu like Lightning Armor moot as one would have to drop said (very expensive) jutsu to use even a simple D-rank one.

This is something Trey has told me directly. There are a few exceptions to this apparently unwritten rule such as the act of tree climbing and certain clan jutsu like the byakugan/sharingan/etc.

I agree that it should be reflected in the rules somewhere. I also think it should be made more lenient because there are canon examples of two jutsu being used in conjunction with one another by the same shinobi.

Example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UXmWu6oi2U&t=33

But unfortunately, as a trial mod I don't have the authority to make this happen. I can only go off the instruction I've received from the admin. Sadly, I don't have any quotes from Trey to give you, I don't even know where to begin looking for one. I'm not sure whether this was said in skype chat, skype staff chat, or in a pm and I'm not about to spend an hour of my life looking it up. But I can link you to this discussion thread where Persy has backed this statement up.

http://www.ultimateshinobi.org/t15981-active-passive-jutsu-types

If you require further confirmation, you're welcome to pm Trey or Josi and ask about it.

Quote :
In the same vein, while I wish you luck as a "hand seal count" is something that should have been added from day one (and I use the concept in my own Naruto campaign) I am going to say NO to adding a fixed number of hand seals to these unless you can again prove that this is an actual rule by the staff and not something you want to see implemented. Why is for several reasons. One because with regards to the majority of weaponry techniques it simply makes zero sense as the characters hand shouldn't leave the weapon in a fight.  Two, there is no such mention for any of the jutsu in the encyclopedia, which I would think would be updated BEFORE such a rule went into force, if only to the supposedly over-worked staff from having to redo the same material twice. Mostly though because I've been through every single section of the rules since I joined this site and never ONCE has there been mention of a requirement for jutsu to list the number of handseals. Nor in all the time here have I had or even heard of a staff member requiring a jutsu to list the number of handseals, or even mentioned adding such to the encyclopedia jutsu.

The update the the encyclopedia I mentioned prior is also to include adding hand seals to all relevant jutsu.

As you pointed out, it's stilly for weaponry techs to have jutsu and therefore, I believe they are an exception to the bunch. As would be puppetry jutsu, genjutsu used through mediums, and certain doujutsu. The exact details on what should and shouldn't be allowed an exception to this need to be worked out by staff as a whole still.

Thankfully, I happen to remember the thread in which I first saw Trey require handseals of someone's jutsu being approved which is what sparked me to begin this mad quest of updating the encyclopedia and requesting it of all jutsu I approve in the first place.

http://www.ultimateshinobi.org/t15889-just-a-few-techs-for-some-af-pwease#123850
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NuclearTreerat
NuclearTreerat

Age : 48
Posts : 1036

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptySun 15 Mar 2015, 2:03 am

Okay, since you actually provide some names - and I know how rarely puts decisions into writting - you've convinced me that at least you're being honest. So while I still think this isn't going to end well, if the people calling the shots want to throw out 5 year of material I'll play along. At least until they end up complaining about the extra work that results. First off though I have a few requests if this is going to go smoothly.

1) Do you have a rough guideline for how many seals a "typical" jutsu of each rank will require? If I'm going to have to update every jutsu on my character I only want to have to do it once instead of 2 or 3 times.
2) I'm going to need quite a bit of time because now I have to revamp the not only techniques in question but pretty much the entire lot. Not only to add a section for hand seals to each but to account for the fact that now many of them really have no point in being multi-post jutsu. So now I'm going to use and abuse the ever living daylights out of that "customize" rule to make them make sense.
3) I also need - yet again - to get the character's clan unlocked so I can - yet again - try to fit it into this utterly inconsistent and constantly shifting mess called rules. Since every one of the jutsu used there are dependent on one other, which has not only a high activation cost but a time limit before it can be reactivated, it simply isn't going to work as it stands.

That said I'm not giving up on the remaining jutsu we're discussing but I'm going to shift prioritizing my arguments in their favor to a lower priority while I fix the rest.
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Mugen Kousen
Mugen Kousen

Age : 33
Posts : 718

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptySun 15 Mar 2015, 9:30 pm

Quote :
1) Do you have a rough guideline for how many seals a "typical" jutsu of each rank will require?

For encyclopedia jutsu I've been looking for their canon counterparts and presenting hand seals based on those. I've also been updating the descriptions of them to better match said canon versions, although some are remaining unique in some ways for various reasons regarding balance or system continuity.

But basically, hand signs don't really seem to be affected by the rank of a jutsu. So if you got it from the encyclopedia check the wiki or canon sources(all episodes are up on youtube and the wiki usually has source references.) and if it's a custom just use your best judgement. Depending on the complexity of the jutsu staff may ask for more or suggest less with fairness in mind.

Hopefully as I get more feedback in the staff section we can work out some kind of standard though that strays from canon but has a better place on the forum for balance sake.

Quote :
2) I'm going to need quite a bit of time because now I have to revamp the not only techniques in question but pretty much the entire lot.

Take all the time you need. Just bump this when you're ready for another look over.

Quote :
I also need - yet again - to get the character's clan unlocked so I can - yet again - try to fit it into this utterly inconsistent and constantly shifting mess called rules.

Your clan jutsu was among the things Trey pm'd me about. He has still not replied to the feedback I gave, but it's possible he might determine your shroud jutsu to be one of the clan-based exceptions to the multi-jutsu limitation. I'll unlock your clan, but I highly recommend getting confirmation from Trey before you go changing everything. I'll send him another reminder about that pm on skype, but I encourage you to reach out to him as well for a more direct response so I'm not playing telephone when it's probably a discussion you should be a part of as the clan creator.
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NuclearTreerat
NuclearTreerat

Age : 48
Posts : 1036

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyTue 17 Mar 2015, 4:18 am

Eh, cannon. If you don't object I think I'm going to stick with a straight mathematical sequence for now.

Especially since there seems to be literally NO rhyme or reason to the number of hand seals the cannon jutsu give as used. I mean none. The classic example; the water dragon projectile is said to take 100+ hand seals but the Niidamie hokage pulls it off in one. Supposed crazy affinity or not that speaks of a lot of "dramatic license" (aka lazy animators). Then there are the times we see a jutsu used only once and never see the handseals (example: the suigidan) at all or the hand seals are simply shown as a blur except the final one. Again, classic example being the first time we see the Grand Fireball (when Sasuke uses it against Kakashi) - I think maybe 4 seals are shown clearly but the rest are just blurs. Plus the data for most I've been able to find is basically just a few people's best guess that others have taken as gospel.

For my own group we ended up throwing out the "cannon" listings and went with a straight math-based system. In a nut shell the number of required seals starts at 1 for E-rank with each rank beyond adding an amount equal to its numerical value (so +2 at D, +3 at C, +5 B, etc up to +6 at S) to the previos ranks total. Now granted our system also ties into our jutsu creation rules which is a bit more work at the creators end than here (but personally I think vastly better in the long run). So a direct translation might not work perfectly, especially since our hand seals counts aren't the actual number of seals per say but rather how much time any one technique takes to implenent while you seem to be looking for a direct count. However I really suggest considering something along those lines that minimizes subjective judgements about nebulous concepts like complexity.

Otherwise you'll have to basically guess at how complex something is on a case-by-case basic which - being highly subjective will vary from mod to mod - with all the attendant problems. Including more work as arguments about how complex - and thus how many seals - technique A takes versus technique B, etc. Not saying you couldn't make something like that work but its something that you might want to reevaluate in light of the potential pitfalls.
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Mugen Kousen
Mugen Kousen

Age : 33
Posts : 718

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyTue 17 Mar 2015, 10:24 pm

I'll bring your suggestion to the table, but personally I'm against making seals based on rank. I'll keep my reasons to myself for now as they aren't strong enough to warrant throwing the idea out the window. I'll definitely forward your concerns to the staff discussion thread. Sadly, Trey has been MIA for a few days now so it hasn't made any progress since my last post. I wish I had more news other than that to give you v.v
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Hiruzen
Hiruzen

Age : 32
Posts : 1178

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyThu 30 Apr 2015, 12:43 pm

Since this has been a WIP for a long time, I have to ask. Is there still work being done on this application or has it been forgotten? If work is still being done, let me know and this post will be removed. If no reply has been made within the next seven days, I will move it into the archives.
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Hiruzen
Hiruzen

Age : 32
Posts : 1178

Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
PostSubject: Re: Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) EmptyWed 06 May 2015, 10:20 pm

Moved.
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Hinamori, Toshiro [Konoha Sennin] (Done) Vide
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