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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing

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Tsurugi
Tsurugi

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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptySun 22 Apr 2012, 7:32 pm

Okay before I start asking and stuff I want to say this:

I know that I may be US’s WORST roleplayer and I freaking suck at most things here, but still..... I’ve been here for about for months, and now I have some questions piling up inside me, concerning fuuinjutsus and weapons.

While writing this I do not intend to insult anyone, I may use the wrong words to express myself or completely write stuff which may not make sense to you, I am sorry for that, but please don't think I have a bad opinions about anyone since I highly respect all of you mods that take your time for us and create systems etc. which helps us have fun while rping, you are all great and I love you.
So lets start:
______________________________________________________________________
1) I probably need an addition to some of my weapons and maybe even some jutsus (not sure bout this...) after the new Scroll sealing guide came out, I just understood this now, which is why I didn't said anything sooner. Here's the weapons that may cause problems:

Spoiler:


As you can see the problems here are:

-the glove is not a scroll and therefore there is no rule to it containing weapons which may cause unwanted problems in the future.

- I originally had planned to seal all/ most of my weapons on my characters body in order to not have to carry a stupidly high amount of scrolls with me, looking at it now I don't think you guys will still allow me to do so....

- It says this is a big scroll.... this was created when there was still no scroll guide so it needs only simple edition

Can you tell me if i have to edit all of these?

_______________________________________________________________________
2) Where can I have sealed weapons carried with me?
-can I only carry weapons around in scrolls or like stated above have them sealed on my body?

- My character carries paper cards along with him... can I have weapons already sealed on those cards when they state that their sealing location has to be stated at the beginning of a topic?
(Can i have weapons stored not only in scrolls but for example, on single pieces of paper)
_______________________________________________________________

3) This is not really a question... but concerns your Scroll Guide...
I have big concerns with you scroll guide.... a Giant scroll can only carry 50 ninja tools ? WHAT?
Spoiler:
This seems to be a pretty small scroll, it really is tiny and might only have 10 tools inside.... looking at how tiny it is.....
Spoiler:
This is one of tentens small scrolls she had during the chuunin exams... these, too, were very tiny but still consisted about hundreds of weapons.... OP i would say so too.... but just look how far this stuff stretches....

now lets get to the giant scrolls..... this
Spoiler:
and this
Spoiler:
Are well known giant scrolls from the series.....
AND THEY ARE.... giant.
I say at least millions of seals fit in there looking at how FAT AND freaking LONG these seem to be. OP, too... i guess.
But seriously.... 50 tools inside such a thing? That’s highly unlikeable...
Seeing as to how ranged weaponry jutsus which are specialized pin point accuracy are about to... NEVER hit.... due to the simple fact that almost any ninja can just step aside and therefore dodge the weapon, if it doesn't travel at sonic speed i don't see any reason why a single ninja tool should ever hit someone.
Ranged attacks power lie in mass, not accuracy, therefore i only think it is fair that the amount of ranged weapons able to be carried along AND the amount of ranged weapons able to being sealed in a single scroll should be enlarged... a lot. It just sucks to have like... 100 of these giant scrolls sealed inside other scrolls which are sealed in other stores etc. just to have the proper amount of weapons in order to use some jutsus. It would drain chakra like shit only to use the scrolls..... that's not really fair... as to how i give up using ninjutsu or other shit just so that I can get my chakra drained like hell to use some weapons which may never hit (of course there is more to fuuinjutsu, but this is the basic of it).

Too, i recommend having different scrolls. In Naruto uses a different scroll for his corpses, with different seals, than a normal scroll like tentens. Just make some kind of body scroll or something which follows other criteria as a normal scroll.....
_______________________________________________________________________
4) What about enlarged seals?
We all know about Sasukes wristband seal, he has like 100 shuriken sealed inside there, it clearly is a improved form of the standard storage seal and shouldn't be such a big deal to create here in US.
I already have a similar jutsu which allows me to have 10 weapons sealed inside a single seal, it didn't cause too much trouble.

Here it is now the real question: How would those enlarged seals affect scrolls? If I were to seal 50 shuriken in one seal and seal that one seal inside a scroll, would it count as 1 seal or as 50?


Last edited by xCROSS on Mon 23 Apr 2012, 8:40 am; edited 2 times in total
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Celene
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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptySun 22 Apr 2012, 9:54 pm

Okay.
I'll admit, this is quite confusing.

Can you please post again with your questions clearly stated?
Thank you :]
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Tsurugi
Tsurugi

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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptySun 22 Apr 2012, 10:07 pm

edited + fixed spoilers
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 3:16 am


1) I don't really have too much of an issue with any of your items. The scroll sealing system was, in my mind, designed to outline the limitations of scrolls and provide more of a guideline for other sealing methods. Your body sealing idea should also not be too much of an issue as long as it's kept reasonable in terms of quantity and power. Can't have you sprouting an infinite amount of weapons from every inch of your body or anything like that.

2) You aren't limited to just scrolls, they are just the most common. You'd have to write up Jutsu and Equipment descriptions for your body sealing techniques for me to judge individually whether they are appropriate but initially it seems fine to me.

3) You answered your own question. The reason scrolls are capped at 50 ninja tools is simply because any more would be OP. I don't think you comprehend just how big of a number 50 is when it comes to shuriken sized projectiles. Quantity over accuracy isn't true either, that's why we have accuracy based Special Characteristics. The point of those SC's is that no, any random person CAN'T just dodge your projectiles because you are just that good which makes sense if a person has dedicated their life to projectile weaponry use. Your idea of different scroll types is interesting and I'll definitely think about it though.

4) Sasuke is the very definition of Canon being OP in a roleplaying context. The proposed jump from 10 to 100 is a big deal and probably wouldn't be allowed since it's far too great a number. You also wouldn't be allowed to seal such a seal into a scroll as that's far too similar to sealing a scroll within a scroll which we don't allow.

Hope that answered everything.
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Enzo
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 3:31 am

Shinji wrote:

1) I don't really have too much of an issue with any of your items. The scroll sealing system was, in my mind, designed to outline the limitations of scrolls and provide more of a guideline for other sealing methods. Your body sealing idea should also not be too much of an issue as long as it's kept reasonable in terms of quantity and power. Can't have you sprouting an infinite amount of weapons from every inch of your body or anything like that.

2) You aren't limited to just scrolls, they are just the most common. You'd have to write up Jutsu and Equipment descriptions for your body sealing techniques for me to judge individually whether they are appropriate but initially it seems fine to me.

3) You answered your own question. The reason scrolls are capped at 50 ninja tools is simply because any more would be OP. I don't think you comprehend just how big of a number 50 is when it comes to shuriken sized projectiles. Quantity over accuracy isn't true either, that's why we have accuracy based Special Characteristics. The point of those SC's is that no, any random person CAN'T just dodge your projectiles because you are just that good which makes sense if a person has dedicated their life to projectile weaponry use. Your idea of different scroll types is interesting and I'll definitely think about it though.

4) Sasuke is the very definition of Canon being OP in a roleplaying context. The proposed jump from 10 to 100 is a big deal and probably wouldn't be allowed since it's far too great a number. You also wouldn't be allowed to seal such a seal into a scroll as that's far too similar to sealing a scroll within a scroll which we don't allow.

Hope that answered everything.
I want to have your adopted babies...
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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 3:32 am

Enzo wrote:
Shinji wrote:

1) I don't really have too much of an issue with any of your items. The scroll sealing system was, in my mind, designed to outline the limitations of scrolls and provide more of a guideline for other sealing methods. Your body sealing idea should also not be too much of an issue as long as it's kept reasonable in terms of quantity and power. Can't have you sprouting an infinite amount of weapons from every inch of your body or anything like that.

2) You aren't limited to just scrolls, they are just the most common. You'd have to write up Jutsu and Equipment descriptions for your body sealing techniques for me to judge individually whether they are appropriate but initially it seems fine to me.

3) You answered your own question. The reason scrolls are capped at 50 ninja tools is simply because any more would be OP. I don't think you comprehend just how big of a number 50 is when it comes to shuriken sized projectiles. Quantity over accuracy isn't true either, that's why we have accuracy based Special Characteristics. The point of those SC's is that no, any random person CAN'T just dodge your projectiles because you are just that good which makes sense if a person has dedicated their life to projectile weaponry use. Your idea of different scroll types is interesting and I'll definitely think about it though.

4) Sasuke is the very definition of Canon being OP in a roleplaying context. The proposed jump from 10 to 100 is a big deal and probably wouldn't be allowed since it's far too great a number. You also wouldn't be allowed to seal such a seal into a scroll as that's far too similar to sealing a scroll within a scroll which we don't allow.

Hope that answered everything.
I want to have your adopted babies...

I'll just adopt him. I mean, it's the humane thing to do right? There's so many Asians without homes. D:

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Tsurugi
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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 8:47 am

Well i will keep on with my body sealing then.

Even through i still have concerns with the scrolls, of course YOU are the mods, you make the rules. But seriously now? 50 weapons? ONLY 50?
To be honest i would rather have five small scrolls carried along with me than having that really really GIANT one around my back. No one would use such a giant scroll with it's current weapon amount, it's just to big and handy for that.
and like i said, one million weapons would be OP but not like 100 or a bit more, all i am saying is that it costs a shit load of chakra just to release all that weapons so how is it OP to have some more with oneself..... well this issue may never be solved to my favour so i wil just stop with this now....
For the different type of scrolls, i have more reasons for it.
For example the swords of the Hidden in the mist swordsmen were all stored in a special scroll, and the summoning contract scroll seems different than the simple weapon scrolls, too

And last:
Well jeah sasuke is friking OP, but i don't think it would be OP for a S-Rank enlarged seal to have 100 shurikens inside.... since my 10 weapon enlarged seal is D-Rank...

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Akuma
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 10:20 am

first of all, tenten was one of the weakest characters, and is underpowered even in an RP sense , and she summoned a massive amount of weapons from small to medium scrolls.

I get the normal items, that are D ranked + being highly limited, but seriously, if two people are S ranked, and an S ranked unsealed.... 10,000 shuriken, kunai, and senbon towards the other person, the other would simply go ( C ranked aoe/armor/sunshin/projectile) bam, all of those weapons were rendered completely useless with minimal effort.

Also, even if you had an accuracy SC, there's always a way around weapons, especially at range. Even if you can hit a fly at 100 meters, as soon as you throw it, I can move an inch, and your weapon would miss, hence you needing to throw 4 more at the same time in a spread pattern to make sure it's harder to dodge, and even then, the person can dodge and block the one that would hit them.

So, let's take the genin maximum, 10 in a small scroll. You launch all of them at me, in a large spread pattern. A simple dodge or minimal chakra usage jutsu, and you just exhausted all of the weapon user's attack options.

The only way to really play a weapon user is sneaky, with senbon and medical knowledge, or close-mid range with chains, swords, scythes, nunchaku, etc.
------------------------------------------------------------

Now then, I'm not saying that currently weaponry is completely useless, I love weaponry, just saying currently people can not weapon spam, which sort of cuts off some fun and interesting strategies.

But, it's much easier and more effective to choose other weapons to store in the scrolls, and simply never even bother with basic weaponry.... minus explosive notes, those things are awesome.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 10:50 am


How is the cost giant? 1 CP to unseal the scroll? It's 1 for the entire or part thereof contents of the scroll, not 1 per item...

As for Tenten, no.....she was one of the few members of the Konoha 12 who WEREN'T overpowered. That doesn't make her weak, just normal. It's easy to say that she's weak when compared to Naruto, Sasuke and Lee who were all capable of things they shouldn't have been and Neji and Hinata who she naturally has a disadvantage against because of Hakkeshuo Kaiten and the defense it offers. Compared to people like Ino, Chouji, Shikamaru, Kiba, Shino and Sakura, all shinobi of equal rank to her, Tenten is just as capable in combat.

As for your S Rank example, if the scroll user has sealed E Rank weaponry in their scrolls then they've handicapped themselves in the same way that a Ninjutsu specialized Jounin would be if they spent their battles spamming C Ranked techniques. Considering they're capable of wielding at least 5 S Rank weapons and the power that S Rank weapons can have, I'd argue that simple dodging would be useless.

Once again, you're downplaying just how significant pinpoint accuracy is. Against someone equal to them in rank, a weapons specialist with pinpoint accuracy would be very difficult to counter. Why? Because short of having speed increasing SC's or utilizing defensive techniques, the weapons specialist can launch their projectiles with such quickness, velocity and predictive aiming that simply dodging is very difficult, if not impossible. To suggest otherwise would be bordering on GM'ing.
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Tsurugi
Tsurugi

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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 12:01 pm

Shinji wrote:

How is the cost giant? 1 CP to unseal the scroll? It's 1 for the entire or part thereof contents of the scroll, not 1 per item...

As for Tenten, no.....she was one of the few members of the Konoha 12 who WEREN'T overpowered. That doesn't make her weak, just normal. It's easy to say that she's weak when compared to Naruto, Sasuke and Lee who were all capable of things they shouldn't have been and Neji and Hinata who she naturally has a disadvantage against because of Hakkeshuo Kaiten and the defense it offers. Compared to people like Ino, Chouji, Shikamaru, Kiba, Shino and Sakura, all shinobi of equal rank to her, Tenten is just as capable in combat.


that part was very interesting. Up until now that wasn't clear and i would like to confirm the truth of it.
Up until now it allways looked and sounded as if you can only unseal one seal through the use of the chouzou no jutsu/ storage jutsu.
Would this mean that i could release multiple seals, too with just the 2Cp cost of the single jutsu? If yes that would be VERY helpful and maybe should be added to the technique....


Quote :
As for your S Rank example, if the scroll user has sealed E Rank weaponry in their scrolls then they've handicapped themselves in the same way that a Ninjutsu specialized Jounin would be if they spent their battles spamming C Ranked techniques. Considering they're capable of wielding at least 5 S Rank weapons and the power that S Rank weapons can have, I'd argue that simple dodging would be useless.

But isn't exactly that the reason why one is supposed to be able to carry along a invinit amount of e+d rank weapons? Since they are so weak that they ar about to make up to no damage?
And not anyone wants to wait to rank up to Jounin in order to finally hit someone with his techniques.... looking at your statements it kind of looks like you want me to get my ass beaten until i can finally get myself a proper weapon.....
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Enzo
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 10:56 pm

First of all, you're using the word infinite like it's a challenge. You can't hold an infinite amount of weapons, for several OBVIOUS reasons; but I won't go into that. A ninja can carry what is realistically plausible. About 100 E-ranked kunai-sized weapons seems about right. Even then, the weapons would pretty much coat the entire body. The rest should be sealed in a scroll. Also; 50 smaller scrolls would weigh, oh, 5 times as much as a gigantic scroll. If you pick up one brick at a time, though each individual brick may not weigh much, eventually it'll be heavy as hell. Why do you think a bag of sand is so hard to lift? Now for your more recent question:

Quote :
But isn't exactly that the reason why one is supposed to be able to carry along a invinit amount of e+d rank weapons? Since they are so weak that they ar about to make up to no damage?
And not anyone wants to wait to rank up to Jounin in order to finally hit someone with his techniques.... looking at your statements it kind of looks like you want me to get my ass beaten until i can finally get myself a proper weapon.....
Any weapon is lethal when used strategically. A well timed kunai, when combined with strategic distractions and a well rounded offense; could kill someone if it lands directly. This is why accuracy SC is so useful. Because it allows you to RP to the full extent of this strategy, without the enemy saying "Oh, I dodged it because I could." I honestly don't even know what your question is related to anymore scratch
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Tsurugi
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyMon 23 Apr 2012, 11:14 pm

This simply became a discussion about ranged weapons which i think is VERY interesting seeing as we all have such different oppinions of them.

First of all.... 50 small scrolls are supposed to weight much?
Their paper rolled around wood or smth. scrolls arn't heavy, they just take away space.... and 50 small scrolls take less space than 1 giant scroll....

and let's stay serious..... a kunai lethal? The enemy would need to have two broken legs... be out of chakra and probably even unconscious before he accepts that i with a maximal strenght improvement + maximal aim would be able to kill him by piercing his head with a senbon or a kunai.... and as we see in the serie... all the throwing weapons just stick inside the body and beside a senbon (which are the most lethal of all throwing weapons in RL) and the kunais (if their shape would be changed to a logical form, one that would actually work out) it is even logical that they won't get killed by a ranged weapon. And even when one kind of understands that he would die from a thrown weapon i don't want to think about the amount of weapons i had to throw before this happened.....

And if i listen to what you said about 100 weapons maximal on one body.... and looking how one person should only be able to carry 1 giant scroll and in your oppinion not even 50 small scrolls.....
i would guess the maximal amount of weapons one can carry along with himself is about....200 maximal 300 and if we are EXTREME generious we may even go up to 400.
It was said that tenten was one of the not OP characters of naruto... and she still had more than 400 weapons with her before she even was chunin, to carry around 400 weapons at max would require me to already be a Jonin.... and jeah, i could use loopholes like using GIANT seals to store like MANY weapons in a single seal which again would be placed on my body or stuff..... but seriously o.ô i don't want to... i don't want to need to find a loophole just so that i may can use like 3 future S-rank jutsus in single post....
I mean OF COURSE: i could stick to you guys and just make jutsus which maximal allow me to throw like 10 shurikens... or even just a single one at extreme speed..... but doesn't that limitate the use of Ranged Weaponry massive?

I may be just getting a bit to heated up here.... but dang.... can you at least understand what i trie to say? I don't want to have only Ranged Weaponry jutsus which i have to think extreme hard about just to make it a bit original.... and i don't want to only make ranged weaponry jutsus which need me to use wire and stuff......


Shinji wrote:
Quote :
How is the cost giant? 1 CP to unseal the scroll? It's 1 for the entire or part thereof contents of the scroll, not 1 per item...

As for Tenten, no.....she was one of the few members of the Konoha 12 who WEREN'T overpowered. That doesn't make her weak, just normal. It's easy to say that she's weak when compared to Naruto, Sasuke and Lee who were all capable of things they shouldn't have been and Neji and Hinata who she naturally has a disadvantage against because of Hakkeshuo Kaiten and the defense it offers. Compared to people like Ino, Chouji, Shikamaru, Kiba, Shino and Sakura, all shinobi of equal rank to her, Tenten is just as capable in combat.

Still would like to hear about that.....
is it true? can i unseal a uncertin amount ofweapons with the single jutsu?
and does that mean i can seal a uncertain amount of weapons, too, with the normal storage jutsu?
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Akuma
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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyWed 25 Apr 2012, 12:19 am

I was just trying to argue that there is no harm in allowing people to seal a lot more basic weapons into a scroll.

That's only if the person wants to, I wasn't debating that all weaponry is useless, I said that trying to weapon spam is if it is so limited.

Shinji proved my point that it's pretty dumb to use basic weapons when you have higher ranked really good weapons.

I just want to have the freedom to weapon spam if I want to.
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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyWed 25 Apr 2012, 6:30 am


You do realize that each small scroll is fifteen centimeters in height right? 50 Of those would definitely be of no small weight nor would they take up less space than 1 giant scroll that is one meter in height.

Your opponent is obviously thinking too highly of himself then. Having precision accuracy and a quick draw obviously doesn't guarantee 'one shot one kill' situations but it certainly means every projectile thrown has the capacity to kill, regardless of size. Projectile weapons in the hands of someone highly trained in their use became far more dangerous than they would be when used by a regular shinobi in the same way that a sword is much more dangerous in the hands of a swordsman than a regular shinobi.

Tenten wasn't OP because her abilities were not beyond those that should be available to her rank. If we use her fight against Temari in the Chuunin exams as an example though, you'll notice two things; Firstly, her scrolls are well beyond even a gigantic scroll in length yet still have the same height as a small scroll so obviously they aren't just standard scrolls. Secondly, your figure of 400 weapons is far too exaggerated. Looking at the number of projectiles that Temari actually deflects, those two scrolls held no more than 25 weapons each.

The methods you mentioned also aren't loopholes, I've noticed the possibility of such things and purposefully left them unchanged because, in my mind, someone experienced in sealing should have little problems sealing multiple items in a single more powerful seal. Also, the creation of custom Jutsu for any of the specializations is really only limited by the abilities of your character, the guidelines of the site and the creator's imagination. At some point your argument became less about any massive issue with weapon sealing and more about your personal preference when it comes to what can be done.

Also, regarding the storage technique, my interpretation is that the cost applies to each use of the technique, not each item sealed or unsealed. There may be staff that disagree with me though so I wouldn't take my word as final.
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Adam
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptySat 16 Jun 2012, 10:37 am

So this is solved, right?
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Tsurugi
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptySat 16 Jun 2012, 12:00 pm

well i realized all of the mods think that with 50 up to 100 shuriken you may overcome any problems, since i can no longer use all my future jutsus like this, seeing how i would loose most of my weapons after one use, i am very unpleased with the outcome of my question but jeah, i guess this is solved, and what did we learn kiddies:

~don't try to argue with mods~

well theres still one thing i wanna know:
"Also, regarding the storage technique, my interpretation is that the cost applies to each use of the technique, not each item sealed or unsealed. There may be staff that disagree with me though so I wouldn't take my word as final."

that was shinjis last words, they true? can i like unseal the weapons in that seal and in that scroll with only the 1 jutsu, or do i need to perform the jutsu two times?
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Tsurugi
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Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Vide
PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyThu 19 Jul 2012, 2:08 pm

doesn't seem like anyone intends to answer my question so this may as well get archived -_-*
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PostSubject: Re: Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing Fuuinjutsu and Weapon sealing EmptyWed 29 Aug 2012, 12:13 am


Solved.
scratch
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