Enzo wrote:

You used the word "de-evolve" which implies it's a bad thing as we're stepping down a notch. Pick your words wisely

Also; professions are already being made. Pretty sure I mentioned this in some other forum assistance topic a week ago or two ago. Problem is, I have no idea when they'll be done.

The rest of the statements I'll refrain from addressing as Adam was the one who thought limiting the least sought after rank was a good idea, and should thus be the one to defend his own case. #standle

Gilgamesh wrote:

Well I do believe them less elegant, less driven by story and more by a thirst to blood-lust and more prone to argument.

Bad I reserve for sites such as NRPG(less than 50 word posts, power-mad mods, sandbox site)

Sörä♀ wrote:

I do believe Sophie was talking about the CREATION of Nuke-nins. Though I can't be positive.

Yep, this is the case.

NuclearTreerat wrote:

That is what I'm talking about - people automatically assuming that a nuke-nin must be those things. Of course the whole idea falls flat on its face since there is no actual rule that says a nuke-nin can't be as much a hero-type or as sociable as a village-nin. The only difference between a "regular" village-nin and a nuke-nin is that the later isn't tied to a particular village and because of that has to watch their back a bit more. Even then its mostly from NPCs because, if properly played, there is no reason why a nuke-nin can't establish a working association (or more) with a village-nin.

Except that on this site, criminals and nukenin are one and the same. There is no 'wanderers' rank. Whether it be desertion, murder, fraud - whatever - they have a record that makes a relationship with villagers more complicated and much less easy than you make it sound. Mind you, it's not impossible. Perhaps if the nukenin in question had been framed for something, or they were desperately seeking redemption...

NuclearTreerat wrote:

Aside from that, the only sure way I know to get more new players to make nuke-nin characters is to convince them by actions that being a nuke-nin doesn't mean playing on "single player" mode. Put it bluntly until the remaining nuke-nin step up and start being visible by being at least as active as the villages, new players aren't going to be very inclined to consider being nuke-nin. Fair? Probably not but neither is life.

Ah, I'm sorry - my use of the word 'fair' wasn't really appropriate. What I meant was that, with only one or two people trying to make the nukenin appear active and not 'single player mode', it just makes the task even more difficult. Firstly, no matter how active those players are, I reckon a new recruit will look at the criminal roster and see how sparsely populated it is. Agreed, it will help to have the nukenin RPing well and often, but I don't feel this should be put entirely on the shoulder of such a small number of people. Judging by the response this thread has received, it looks like the users are more than happy to contribute where they can.

Anyway, I almost completely agree with all your reasons for why this problem exists, but deviate when it comes to solving it.

TwinnyKitty wrote:

As far as I'm concerned, all it really needs is those professions to bring it up to equal with villages as far as perks go, and to be made available for our number of Nuke Nin to grow (: They shouldn't need the site to herd and nanny them into activities, the space and tools to make their own is all that I think is really needed for Missing ninja to impact on the site. We just gotta let people get there.

Absolutely. Spoon-feeding people is not something I'll ever promote and I don't think anyone really wants it that way. I'm somewhat in an awkward position here, because my character was started at the rank she is. For all intents and purposes, spoon-fed. I want to have earned this and have worked to do so, but recognize that we need some people starting off higher up the chain. Apart from the fact that it brings variety to the roleplay going on across the forum; who else is going to train up those below?

Gilgamesh wrote:

Shiro wrote:

Bounty Hunter seems like a natural profession for Nukenin. Ya know, Kuzaku-style. It can also be an incentive for Nukenin's to go after one another.

That sir is how sites de-evolve into kill-fests.

Hm. You might be onto something there, Shiro. But Gilly (hope you don't mind the abbreviation) also has a point. A bounty hunter profession would be an excellent way to involve the nukenin in plots and village life. They would have a legitimate reason to visit certain places they'd otherwise avoid, which I can say from experience, is sometimes the hardest part! I'd imagine Kirigakure could run a secret bounty business, whereby it turns a blind eye to criminal activities if the nukenin act as hunters for their village. Ones that cannot be traced back to Kiri and leave the village itself blameless, no matter the outcome. Cool, but it'd need a good deal of restriction and monitoring.

Enzo wrote:

Also; professions are already being made. Pretty sure I mentioned this in some other forum assistance topic a week ago or two ago. Problem is, I have no idea when they'll be done.

The rest of the statements I'll refrain from addressing as Adam was the one who thought limiting the least sought after rank was a good idea, and should thus be the one to defend his own case. #standle

Goody! I'll be looking forward to their arrival. If I missed the 'thing' about it a few weeks ago, I can only apologize (and then point to the great feedback and input we're getting ).

Quote :

Why does everyone go on and on about professions in the first place? Sure they provide a few perks, but on most sites you don't even get those.

Adam wrote:

I was happily sitting back reading this topic until Uros threw my name in the mix, haha. In a way, I'm open to the idea of allowing more Nukenin but opening it up against is something I'm hardly keen on. The past has shown that people utilize the rank as an excuse to sit around and not be as active as village ninja (who undergo constant activity checks) and manage to sit around doing nothing a lot easier.

The sheer number of applicants contrary to Uros' belief wasn't the most low sought out. When faced with the choice of Genin or C-rank Nukenin most people were gunning for Nukenin. I'm concerned at the stunting of village activity that would occur with Nukenin being opened. A group of people in here have stated they would have made Nukenin if the option was there or that they're planning to develop their characters to the point where they leave their villages. Stack Kumo's lack of higher ranks on top of this and it's questionable why we'd open up higher ranks for people who have proven to have a lack of impact on the site.

If anything, I'd be prone to giving out permission to exceptions. For example I know Todd is wanting to return here but was really wanting to make a Nukenin. Slotting him into an A-rank Nukenin spot could help with the revitalization of the rank and a few more could follow but I'm not too keen on actually opening it back up to get constantly applied for.

This sounds reasonable to me. Contrary to my earlier comments, it might be a bit too much to completely open nukenin in one fell swoop. I don't want to exclude this possibility in the future, but you're right Adam - interest seems high and village attrition might be a problem. There's a few things I'd like to address, regardless:

• Why can't nukenin undergo activity checks? I realize that for village-nin, this is usually done through IC topics made by the appropriate Kage. Surely we could have a staff-controlled NPC create a topic for the criminal populace to engage in by way of activity check? If the NPC started things off and then just left well alone, it would only take one post.
  
  
• I'm glad that you agree on the need for some higher ranked baddies around here. Offering exceptions to a worthy few generally seems to work. However, I'd suggest that this will only be the case if we promote the idea. Make it apparent that we want more nukenin, are willing to give higher ranks, but will only accept the best.
  
  
• In a similar vein, I'd love to see the wandering criminal play a more active role in shaping the forum-wide plot. I don't mean spoon-feed them opportunities, but have a few IC systems in place for them to become involved in. I was hoping to approach CleverYamanaka about the possibility of Kirigakure running a bounty service (see my previous post in this topic). On further contemplation, this could by run by any Kage who sees the advantages of it and is not morally against working with criminals. If this came about, the staff could develop parameters that curb the assassination trade. For example: nukenin can only be sent after a target that is of equal or greater rank than they are.

Anyway, that's my take on things.

Adam wrote:

I was happily sitting back reading this topic until Uros threw my name in the mix, haha. In a way, I'm open to the idea of allowing more Nukenin but opening it up against is something I'm hardly keen on. The past has shown that people utilize the rank as an excuse to sit around and not be as active as village ninja (who undergo constant activity checks) and manage to sit around doing nothing a lot easier.

The sheer number of applicants contrary to Uros' belief wasn't the most low sought out. When faced with the choice of Genin or C-rank Nukenin most people were gunning for Nukenin. I'm concerned at the stunting of village activity that would occur with Nukenin being opened. A group of people in here have stated they would have made Nukenin if the option was there or that they're planning to develop their characters to the point where they leave their villages. Stack Kumo's lack of higher ranks on top of this and it's questionable why we'd open up higher ranks for people who have proven to have a lack of impact on the site.

If anything, I'd be prone to giving out permission to exceptions. For example I know Todd is wanting to return here but was really wanting to make a Nukenin. Slotting him into an A-rank Nukenin spot could help with the revitalization of the rank and a few more could follow but I'm not too keen on actually opening it back up to get constantly applied for.

Blaine wrote:

No but seriously Purple is awesome, dont change that color.

TwinnyKitty wrote:

Blaine wrote:

No but seriously Purple is awesome, dont change that color.

TwinnyKitty wrote:

The existence of Nukenin has no less purpose than the existence of any other shinobi on the site, they all exist because interesting characters warm our hearts and fill us with all these tingly good feels like excitement, pride and amusement (:

Erm, I guess? We seem to have established that:

A) Nukenin professions are in the works.
B) The site is open to more nukenin applying and will consider those requesting higher ranks.

Plus this topic has hopefully promoted the notion of joining the criminal ranks, perhaps even setting up 'business' relationships between nukenin and villages. All this can only be good. :-)

I'm happy to wrap this up now - anyone else?