Is ranking up unreasonable?

Posts : 18

heh.. oh, well then sorry Enzo ^^ *highfives*

Age : 31 Posts : 8965

WTFlash wrote:: I'm alittle sad that people are speaking out and being ignored. This is not a good way for a site to interact with it's members.

Look at this topic, Flash. It's hardly a one sided thing you have two groups in here its not everybody wants it to be decreased. This is hardly being ignored, both Enzo and I have posted in this topic and are completely up to date with it. On top of this we have a system currently being developed that is so close to being implemented, which now is put on hold so we can address the concerns in this topic. If anything right now this topic is a priority which is why as John stated things like Nuclear post which had some quite valid points that weren't as simple as "Why do I have to roleplay so much to rank up?" is being discussed so we can respond to it accordingly. Despite a few bumps in this topic due to some unnecessary shots at one another I think this topic is pretty healthy right now whether change follows or not. Your comment is hardly appreciated.

Nuclear wrote:: 1) Remov Ranking points from the requirement for "ranking up." From an "in character" perspective it makes very little sense that someone's ability to socialize would determine their fitness for a higher ranking on the battlefield. From a pure mechanics perspective, there isn't any real difference between what goes into a RP-topic and a mission-topic; both typically involve interacting with other players, both require acceptable writing ability, both . The only difference is that "Missions" have to be approved by staff and RP-topics don't. Given that extra set of requirements, I have to ask why something like "Ranking points" even existed, much less was made THE major requirement towards advancing a character. The only thing I can come up with was it was a (rather poorly implemented) attempt to force players to interact outside of combat by saying "do this and you get rewarded, don't and you stay put."

Becky replied to this perfectly.

Persy wrote:: People often mistake the fact that EXP or [RP] is needed for rank ups because of the fact that we want their character to be socially active in the forum. Social topics are important to a character's growth in a rank and it is something that everyone should do. Unfortunately, this isn't true. The inclusion of EXP in the entire process of ranking up is so that members are continuously active within the forum. We want to reward them for taking the initiative to post, and create a community that we all can be involved in. EXP are essential to RP because - let's face it - characters are not all one-sided. Everyone needs to grow emotionally as well as physically and skillfully in order to succeed in this narutoverse and rank is the only way to scale it.

Nuclear wrote:: 2) Allow Ranking points to be converted into Mission points. Keeping in mind #1, instead of requiring both ranking points and mission points, create a single "lump sum" value needed to move up. Then let characters convert "excess" points in one category to the other. This way how someone advances their character is up to them. If they like social/ spar/ whatever stuf then they can do that, or if they would rather take to the battlefield they follow that route. Even if they like both, they can swing from one to the other as they feel and avoid becoming burned out.

They could be considered one big lump now, the only difference is we require you to do a few missions too. If we base it completely off missions, with the current system we have in place evaluators will find themselves reading people in the same scenarios because people will be doing the same missions. That's hardly going to motivate the staff to reread the same thread, sometimes time and time again. So this proposed change will have us have to decrease amounts, combine them into our category, change the way we evaluate topics, edit the entire missions system so there aren't any recyclable missions.

Nuclear wrote:: Second, those topic and mission numbers assume getting good ratings each time. A problem here since the staff have VERY different opinions on what qualifies as "good writing". Nor have they always been able to keep things at a "professional" level when it comes to seeing the work and not the player, both in awarding undeserved points and in withholding points from others for spurious reasons. It would be more reasonable to double those numbers to account for the "luck of the draw" when it comes to which moderator evaluates something and what sort of mood they are in at the time. To me, those can become pretty hefty obstacles for someone, especially if they get "out of sync" with the other members, where they need one thing (ranking points say) and the majority are looking for the other. Certainly big enough to cause someone to get frustrated.

Becky covered this perfectly once again.

Persy wrote:: As Nuclear pointed out, all these amounts are when people score perfectly, or rather high. And when does that ever happen? Yes, it is incredibly hard to monitor how our topics are evaluated, but that is part of any sort of English course. Everything depends on the professor's opinion and what key aspects they look for. This is a natural thing and people need to recognize this. Moving forward, I believe these numbers are practical as well considering how long a mission or thread takes in general. People are busy in their lives and to reach a new rank takes commitment. Posting solidly to gain ranks is not something that people often do and for those that are the exception - I don't believe it is fair that we alter our system for them.

Nuclear wrote:: Then there is the ever-present problem of another participant taking an announced leave due to burn out, change in schedule, etc in a topic, holding things up as the other players wait for a response or even causing it to never finish. I know other sites, in fact I would say the majority, have a rule that states you have so many days to respond or ask for an extension after which your character can be written out and/ or killed by other thread participants. All to prevent a single person to stalling an entire thread.

I thought we had a similar rule here, I'll do some searching and if we don't. Something will have to be implemented.

Age : 34 Posts : 591

Though both sides are represented, I would venture to say that one is the minority and other simply holding on to an old standard of idealism and elitism.

Age : 34 Posts : 1209

In my opinion part of the perceived grind of ranking up comes from the simple fact that this community is pretty irregular in its activity. I mean sometimes you get active spurts but then....you get long drawn out periods of lethargy where the rate of posting really starts to decline. If the community were more active, if people posted more regularly and topics evaluated faster then I bet the "grind" wouldn't be so bad.

Striking this but leaving it up for readability. I don't want people to misinterpret what I mean. Ranking is fine, the slowness of the other people I RP with makes it SEEM like a grind. That's what I was going for. Sorry for confusion.

Age : 34 Posts : 591

You'd think that, but even with a ton of people posting every day..... it gets tired.

Age : 34 Posts : 1209

Well then I'm just speaking from experience that I've been here for about 2 months and I'm at the point where I'm tired of waiting. I'm always waiting and I'm sick of it. I only managed to submit my first eval request about 2 weeks ago, it has been ignored and even the topic itself pretty much fell apart as my partner disappeared. Another longer topic I was in came to a halt as a person has disappeared without any notice, making the topic one that will not be completed and such it won't be submitted. My team has all but fallen apart. So yeah, the ranking up thing looks like a grind to me. RPing has become a chore to me.

Age : 33 Posts : 428

Calculation

Quote :: Genin - 0 Ranking Points, 0 Mission Points.
C Rank Nukenin - 0 Reputation Points.
Experienced Genin - 80 Ranking Points, 20 Mission Points.
Chuunin - 160 Ranking Points, 40 Mission Points.
B Rank Nukenin - 160 Ranking Points, 40 Reputation Points.

Quote :: 20 - max amount of points obtainable

Quote :: 160 / 20 = 8

Quote :: 40 / 20 = 2

10 threads are required for ranking up.

But, that is only if you score a maximum 20 points.

Seems rather easy if you are RPing solo, but there is the fact that most prefer to RP with others.

Quote :: 10 threads = 10 weeks
1 thread = 1 week

10 weeks = 3 months

Approximately you need 3 months to reach Chuunin/B rank.

But only if you score perfectly every time. O:

Easy & Quick Rank Up
- RP alone
- go through lots and lots of thread
- submit every single thread no matter how insignificant it is

That seems kinda wrong....

There should be a bonus for those who RP with others.

Age : 34 Posts : 591

Jesus, three months to reach Chuunin? How bad is the wait for Jounin?

Age : 33 Posts : 428

Wanizame wrote:: Jesus, three months to reach Chuunin? How bad is the wait for Jounin?

Do the math lawl. XD

Age : 29 Posts : 1797

You forget you're allowed to do up to 3 RP topics at once, thus theoretically, your work time could be cut into thirds. Though assuming you don't get perfect scores, let's say you get 10's all the way through, it'd still take only 2 months, like I said at the very beginning. Jounin right now, has exactly the same requirements as every other rank. +160RP, +40MP. One of the reasons we're trying to fix the system, is because the growth is uneven with the ages and character progression.

Age : 33 Posts : 428

If you do them all solo.

It would even take less time, a month max.

By soloing threads you could just finish threads in like 2-3 days, not 1 week.

Age : 33 Posts : 308

So my question is. . .

Who honestly wants to do all that work? Show of hands?

Age : 29 Posts : 796

*ahem*

You're on a damn RP site. You're expected to write... Why the hell did you join a site centered around writing a lot, if you didn't want to put in the hard work and actually do it? And you're acting like it's a lot of work. Please, have you ever RPed on any other site before? 1-2 months to go up an entire TWO ranks, is HARDLY a lot of work. From what it looks like, all you want is for us to make it easier to rank up; when in reality, it's easy enough as it is. We don't tolerate lazy people, nor do we tolerate people complaining and slacking off, when they could be spending that same amount of time accomplishing what they are meant to be doing.

Age : 29 Posts : 1797

WTFlash wrote:: So my question is. . .

Who honestly wants to do all that work? Show of hands?

Is ranking up unreasonable? - Page 2 Whywecanthavenice2

What would you prefer? That we give people a new rank every other week?

Age : 33 Posts : 428

Rail wrote:: Easy & Quick Rank Up
- RP alone
- go through lots and lots of thread
- submit every single thread no matter how insignificant it is

That seems kinda wrong....

There should be a bonus for those who RP with others.

This is the only thing needed of fixing.

Age : 29 Posts : 1797

Rail wrote:

Rail wrote:: Easy & Quick Rank Up
- RP alone
- go through lots and lots of thread
- submit every single thread no matter how insignificant it is

That seems kinda wrong....

There should be a bonus for those who RP with others.

This is the only thing needed of fixing.

The only thing you can solo on this site is Missions. I have no idea how you intend to solo a basic RP. It's not possible. If you travel from a country to another, that doesn't count. If you train jutsu, that doesn't count. If you can give me some examples of a solo topic, then yeah, we probably should; but regardless, there's no possible way for someone to solo an RP by themselves. By definition, it is no longer RP if you're doing it yourself.

Age : 33 Posts : 428

Then pardon, my calculations are wrong. o.o

It takes more than 2-3 months to get that much points as I was under the impression that you can just post in a solo thread doing something. Not training, just RPing alone.

You can't submit travels? I could have sworn that I noticed someone submitting those.

Then it really does take too much time.

Age : 29 Posts : 1797

Quote :: You can't submit travels? I could have sworn that I noticed someone submitting those.

You probably can submit travels, I haven't really checked whether or not it's possible, but I doubt you'd get a lot of points for it. Either way, I don't evaluate topics, so I have no idea how those mods calculate things. I can assume that solo threads usually score lower by default.

Anyway, you all realize ranking up is meant to be a long term goal, right? You're supposed to RP, have fun with others, spar, do missions, etc. The whole point is not to get to the highest rank as quickly as possible, it's to actually RP. Long term goals aren't meant to be accomplished in mere weeks, they're called long term for that reason. I don't understand why you members assume that ranks are something one should achieve easily. There aren't even that many ranks to achieve. You start at C-rank, then you have 3 more ranks to climb; unless you're a village ninja, but that hardly changes anything. It's still 3 solid ranks. B-rank (chuunin), A-rank (Jounin) and S-rank (exp. jounin/kage). If everyone could climb the latter in a matter of a couple months, it defeats the whole purpose of having most people start at a lower rank. There's no challenge or fun to quickly rushing through and finishing things so quickly.

Let me repeat. Your goal as an RPer shouldn't be to reach the highest possible rank; it should be to RP as often as you want, and accomplish what you feel is necessary for character development. If you stick to the idea that your purpose is to rank up, then of course you'll view it as a tedious chore. Anything between you and your goal, is a tedious chore; thus if you view your goal as anything else, it shouldn't be that big of an issue. You'll get there when you get there.

Age : 33 Posts : 428

I'm not saying that they should be achieved easily. Dunno about others, but I don't care about ranks that much, my concern is the fact that I, a player of a low ranked character, am forced to RP some kid.

So when you limit age to ranks....it gets kinda annoying....

Age : 29 Posts : 796

Enzy bear wrote:: You probably can submit travels, I haven't really checked whether or not it's possible, but I doubt you'd get a lot of points for it. Either way, I don't evaluate topics, so I have no idea how those mods calculate things. I can assume that solo threads usually score lower by default.

As a RP mod I'll answer.

It is possible if it's more than one post.
However they mostly score on the lower end if the quality isn't top notch.

Age : 29 Posts : 1797

Rail wrote:: So when you limit age to ranks....it gets kinda annoying....

If that was your issue the entire time, you could have just brought it up in a Forum Assistance question TEEHEE

Either way, the age limits will probably be revoked fairly soon, since I don't really even know why there is an age ceiling.

Age : 33 Posts : 428

Well, this seemed to be a topic dealing with such.

And it was easier to just join in here. XD

Celene wrote:

Enzy bear wrote:: You probably can submit travels, I haven't really checked whether or not it's possible, but I doubt you'd get a lot of points for it. Either way, I don't evaluate topics, so I have no idea how those mods calculate things. I can assume that solo threads usually score lower by default.

As a RP mod I'll answer.

It is possible if it's more than one post.
However they mostly score on the lower end if the quality isn't top notch.

Doesn't this stand for all topics and not just solo ones? XD

Age : 29 Posts : 796

I get picky on solo topics more since they can be less... Interesting

Posts : 21

I'd just like to suggest something.

Personally I think that the lower ranks should be slightly easier to achieve and the higher ones either made harder or kept the same. Perhaps special conditions could be given for the higher ranks, ex. to become an exp. Jounin you have to do ______ or to become a kage you have to kill _______. Just an idea though.

Because it seems to me that it should be a lot harder for you to become a Jounin or a Kage than it would to become a Chuunin. It's one of the lower points on the Ninja Hierarchy(so to speak) so I reckon it should be a tad bit easier to achieve.

Age : 33 Posts : 308

WTFlash wrote:: So my question is. . .

Who honestly wants to do all that work? Show of hands?

Anybody...? Plenty of people have posted since I asked, none have raised their hand so to speak.